Letter from my boss

Steven Hildreth s_p_hildreth at yahoo.com
Sun Feb 24 16:17:58 CST 2002 

Well -  I wish not to start a religious debate on what software is
superior. All I can say is my opinion and experiences, I do not wish for
others to think that I am implying that one language is superior over
the other nor stating that they should choose one language over the
other for every situation. Simply not true - each language I looked at
had very strong points for it and had excellent strengths.

With that "Java Sucks", ;) (just kidding)..

When I began to look for a programming environment that would solve our
cross-platform issue, allow for rapid development and be cost effective
I looked at several different options: Perl, PHP, Python, VB, C#, C,
C++, Visual C, Java, Kylix/Delphi and FoxPro.

First to accomplish pure 100% cross platform (meaning very little (if
any recoding) in order to get the application to run on several
different OS's (primarily Windows 9x/2000 and Linux Redhat Distro)) I
could eliminate a couple (namely MS based) of options right off the bat:
VB, FoxPro and C#.

Seeing that PHP is best suited for website development (and don't get me
wrong it absolutely rocks at that), it did not seem like a good
application environment to develop a database bound application that
would run in a stand alone environments.

The qualifier of rapid development means that I need the coders to be
able to take an idea, prototype that idea and generate a beta
application in a very short period (less than 30 days). The complexity
of C (and its variants), albeit giving C the power that rivals none,
makes it not a strong choice for RAD. With a team of 4 programmers all
being given a different routine (or objectives) to solve and then having
a project manager "glueing" the different routines together, the clarity
of the code needed to be superb.

Clarity and brevity is not the strong suit of Perl, I have seen entire
applications (medium size mind you) in a single line of code in Perl. I
was unable to find mention of the option to run Perl code in Java (like
Jython) and I can see in the future the need to run our developed
application natively (non browser) on a Palm solution (perhaps the new
Sharp Linux based PDA will solve this). 

The choice came down to Java and Python. One of Java's downfalls was the
fact that it is controlled by a corporation (Sun), and any turn they
make (unless a strong fork rises) Java will follow. The application
developed in Java have a very poor GUI appearance. I liked the idea that
Python could use wxPython, tkinter, pyGTK to be able to easily choose
the GUI appearance. Agreed that wxPython is really the best cross
platform solution for GUI development with Python - but the point is
there are other options other than the standard Java interface. Java
also has a pretty mean acclamation period, remember we are talking VB
programmers that have been diluted into thinking VB apps is programming.

Python fit the bill for all of our needs:
	* RAD
 	* Having unquestionable clarity (no Brackets or Squiggles, Yea!)
	* Brief in syntax 
	* Cross platform (there are currently 13 platforms for Python)
	* Complete open source (no corporation driving the train)
	* Large Module library available (why re-invent the wheel?)
	* Quick learning (within several hours I was coding in Python)

The point that Python has issues is unquestionable, IMHO they are:
	* No native compilation (byte code then interpreted)
	* Perceived as a "scripting" language (versus an application)
	* Stupid looking logo (www.python.org)

Perhaps my wild ramblings will help someone.

Provocateur of thought,
Steven

 
On Sat, 2002-02-23 at 21:24, hanasaki wrote:
> Out of curiousity, how did you arrive at Python for cross platform vs 
> other languages?
> 
> Steven Hildreth wrote:
> > I have had lots of luck getting my pure-VB staff to start to using
> > Python and BOA, for cross platform apps with MySQL as the backend.
> > 
> > BOA is a GUI builder that lets you do RAD window layout and then create
> > the Python code to build those windows. IMHO it is about as close as you
> > are going to get to VB in a open source package (BOA is pure python).
> > 
> > http://boa-constructor.sourceforge.net/
> > 
> > Perhaps that is helpful.
> > 
> > Regards,
> > Steven
> > 
> > 
> > On Fri, 2002-02-22 at 10:02, Chris Midkiff wrote:
> > 
> >>Some people seem to just like spending money.  We've been using MySQL and
> >>PHP for web-based development for quite a while now.  Unfortunatly, we still
> >>use VB for most of our desktop apps.  If anyone knows of a way to build a
> >>GUI program, with a little bit of bussiness logic and a database connection,
> >>for the windows platform, with development speed approching that of an
> >>experienced VB programmer, _PLEASE_ let me know what it is.
> >>
> >>Oh well, one battle at a time.
> >>
> >>btw:  Did you _Show_ them the working PostgreSQL solution?  Showing someone
> >>a working system, and letting them know how much it will save them, seems to
> >>be a much better way of getting the point accross than telling them about
> >>it.
> >>
> >>Chris Midkiff
> >>
> >>----- Original Message -----
> >>From: "Marvin Bellamy" <Marvin.Bellamy at innovision.com>
> >>Cc: "Kclug" <kclug at kclug.org>
> >>Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 11:48 AM
> >>Subject: Re: Letter from my boss
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>Kudos for your organization!  To show the bad with the good, I thought I
> >>>had my boss convinced to go with a Linux/PostgreSQL back-end.
> >>> Unfortunately, we've elected to start the process of evaluating Oracle
> >>>for a later commitment.  Installation is a pain because of hardware
> >>>compatibility issues (administration looks like it'll be a bear).  I've
> >>>been screwing around with it for a few days now.  What's ironic is I've
> >>>already got a PostgreSQL installation (with data already ported) running
> >>>on much cheaper hardware that I could start using today!
> >>>
> >>>Chris Midkiff wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Thought some of you might enjoy this...
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>I've been working on my boss (a fully confirmed Microsoft fan & VB
> >>>>developer) for about a year on open source software.   I have
> >>>>convinced the company to allow me to replace our Win2k Advanced Server
> >>>>with Linux (all it does is DCHP and File/Printer sharing).  Also, a
> >>>>week ago I finally convinced him, on a price basis, to try OpenOffice
> >>>>on his WinXP laptop.  The Following is the message that I received
> >>>>from him today (copied by permission):
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>----- Original Message -----
> >>>>
> >>>>I have been using OpenOffice now for a number of days. I created the
> >>>>Essex Manuals using OpenOffice and am in the process of writing the
> >>>>requirements for Butterball. I am more than impressed with this
> >>>>package. So far it has done everything I needed it to. In fact, I
> >>>>think it's actually easier in some ways than MS Office!
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>I have since removed Office XP from my Laptop with the exception of
> >>>>Access and I recommend everyone do the same.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>I see no reason why we should keep MS Office installed other than if
> >>>>it is tied into a package like TigerPaw or QuickBooks and is
> >>>>absolutely necessary.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>Thought you'd like to know!
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>Talk to you kids later.
> >>>>
> >>>>Valère S. Palhoriès
> >>>>DataCapture Technologies Inc.         http://www.datacaptech.com
> >>>>510 Southwest Boulevard, Kansas City, KS  66203 USA
> >>>>
> >>>>       Innovative Solutions for Data Collection
> >>>>
> >>>>----End Message----
> >>>>
> >>>>This weekend, I'm converting our Dual Proc HP Server from Win2000
> >>>>Advanced Server to Redhat 7.2.  Great to see this all coming around
> >>>>after a year of sharing the gospel around here.  Linux Advocacy really
> >>>>does work.. and articles in the Wall Street Journal don't hurt none.
> >>>>They even want me to show how feasible it would be to replace windows
> >>>>with Linux on the desktops for the sales/office personnel.
> >>>>
> >>>>_WOHOO_
> >>>>
> >>>>Chris Midkiff
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _________________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> 
> -- 
> = hanasaki at hanaden.com                                          =
> =     Spam : Unhealthy and High in Sodium and Cholesterol       =
> 
> 
> 

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