KCLUG?!?!?!

[Rich Minear]

No offence taken....however, I think you are being fairly short sighted
about Microsoft....

Don'g get me wrong, I have no love for the company...but some Microsoft
Products are good...

Microsoft Exchange server has been a very good, stable email/scheduling
system for our company....
If you use DHCP, WINS is a very good resource....it works very well.
There are others....

AMC runs Digital Unix (now Compaq), Solaris x86, Linux, NT 4.0, & Citrix
Winframe.

Most of the servers that our normal end users see on a daily basis are NT.
For file and print, or Exchange, they are fairly stable, and have good
uptime.  Not as good as our Unix boxes, but they aren't as big either.

As for being too lazy or stupid to learn something or to RTFM's....not
everyone wants or needs to do these things...
I have 300 end users just in our corporate office that could not give a damn
about RTFM or learning something.  They have a job to do, and they could
care less whether their product was open source, Microsoft, or any
other...they just want the damn thing to work.

Myself, I have 10 Unix servers (6 of which run high end Oracle databases), 2
OpenVMS systems (VAXs for the old guys!), 4 Linux boxes, 15 NT servers, and
227 Cisco Routers to keep up and running.  While doing that with a team of 6
people, I have 5 children, a wife who is a Senior at KU, my own classes for
finishing my degree, and my own training classes (Cisco IOS, NT 2000, Perl,
and shell programming).  I don't have time to RTFM either....

Long story short...Linux is wonderful! I love it...but I live in a Microsoft
dominated world (at least right now). So being able to do both keeps me in
demand in the job market.

Rich

-----Original Message-----
From: Aaron Norton [mailto:anorton98 at earthlink.net]
Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2000 2:19 PM
To: rminear at linuxstart.com
Subject: Re: kclug - KCLUG?!?!?!

Sure Microsoft products have their place - in the hands of end users who
are either too stupid or too lazy to sit down and try to learn something
and/or RTFM's. These are just my personal feelings about Microsoft. I am
not trying to say that you are stupid or anything. You probably have not
had time to play with HTML much.

If you look at the source of the pages you created, the only part that
appears to really require Frontpage is the hover buttons on the left of
the first page. The coding of the pages could very easily be altered to
have no references to Frontpage at all. HTML is very easy to learn,
especially if you have Hot Dog Pro or some software like that which will
create the code for you. Then you can look at the code it created and
pick it up very quickly. I know this because a couple of years ago I set
up a website without having any prior HTML knowledge.

Once again, I'm sorry if you took offense to any of these posts.

Aaron Norton
Sprint
Network Systems Management

Rich Minear wrote:
>
> Aaron,
>
> The server is not a Microsoft Server.....
>
> The web pages were done in Microsoft Frontpage..mostly because the guy who
> did them (and he did a terrible job!!!) does not know HTML.
>
> Now normally, I would not dog someone like this....but it was me...so it
is
> ok...I'm an admin guy, not a programmer.
>
> The new web page...being done by the guys at kclinux.com and some
> volunteers....will be very much non-microsoft.
>
> Rich Minear
>
> PS.  Remember...Microsoft Products have their place...and they are not bad
> products....
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Aaron Norton [mailto:anorton98 at earthlink.net]
> Sent: Friday, January 14, 2000 2:05 PM
> To: rminear at linuxstart.com
> Subject: kclug - KCLUG?!?!?!
>
> I am new to this list and just found your website this morning.
> I have been in the Kansas UNIX/Linux Users Association, off and
> on for a while now and was always interested in finding something
> closer to home since I live in KC.
>
> There is one thing that bothers me about KCLUG. When I went to
> your website, I happened to notice that it was built with (and
> I really hate to say this word) Microsoft.
>
> My question is this - what kind of Linux Users Group builds their
> website using Microsoft Frontpage? I realize that not everyone is
> against Micros??t as much as me, but this just does not make any
> sense at all.
>
> You are supposedly supporting the Open Source Revolution, but
> you are using the most closed companies products to achieve this
> goal.
>
> For the sake of not crashing what is probably a microsoft server,
> I will keep this short. If it is in fact not a microsoft server,
> please accept my sincere appoligies for the previous statement.
>
> Let the flaming begin!!!
>
> Aaron Norton
>